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Added By: Alex
Added on: 06/11/2008 @ 9:03:03 PM
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Politics
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I'm Voting Libertarian

Seriously, I think I will at this point.
View External Link [www.bobbarr2008.com]
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
06/12/2008 @ 10:36:45 AM
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If I were to make a list of people who I know that would be least likely to vote Libertarian I think I'd put you at the top of it. What issues are you with them on? All the issues that I can think of that I know your feelings about you couldn't be more opposite of the Libertarian stance.
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newalex.jpgAlex - I was too weak to give in Too strong to lose
06/12/2008 @ 01:31:29 PM
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Privacy and undoing big government. At least from what I've read on that site so far.
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
06/12/2008 @ 01:46:39 PM
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Like the privacy to make a private choice and a government who wants to keep its nose out of your private sexual matters?

(Not that those are the only two issues, it just seems like they are a big deal to you, and you seem to be a "big government" person in those regards.)
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Jeremy edited this at 06/12/2008 1:49:35 pm
jeremy.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
06/12/2008 @ 01:59:32 PM
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It's worth mentioning that most people would wind up in the Libertarian camp if they took a questionnaire. It's just that a lot of libertarian principals don't work in practice. Not to mention it's sort of goofy to run a government based around the concept that government doesn't work.
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2887.gifAlex - 3618 Posts
06/12/2008 @ 07:16:10 PM
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The government isn't stopping anyone's private sexual lifes (well, there are some laws there, but they're not stopping the ones I assume you're refering too).

It's not a private choice if you believe that there are actually 2 lives involved.

I'm talking more like all the invasions of privacy in the name of counter terrorism.

Plus the privacy and "big government" are 2 different issues in my mind. "Big government" as in not having 8 billion different government programs and spending money like it grows on trees.

Many Democratic and Republican principles don't work in practice either. If you can even identify which party holds to which principles.
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Alex screwed with this at 06/12/2008 8:11:59 pm
matt.jpgMatt - Washington Bureau Chief
06/12/2008 @ 07:47:21 PM
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Jeremy Wrote - 06/12/2008 @ 01:59:32 PM
It's just that a lot of libertarian principals don't work in practice.


I agree. Have you ever seen a libertarian school? The principals don't do anything and let the teachers do whatever they want. Chaos. emoticon
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
06/12/2008 @ 07:51:16 PM
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Don't be an ass.
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thumbnailCAW1I0O3.gifMatt - 3355 Posts
06/12/2008 @ 08:03:55 PM
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Jeremy Wrote - 06/12/2008 @ 01:59:32 PM
It's worth mentioning that most people would wind up in the Libertarian camp if they took a questionnaire. It's just that a lot of libertarian principals don't work in practice. Not to mention it's sort of goofy to run a government based around the concept that government doesn't work.


Seriously though, I don't think you can say that a lot of their principles don't work in practice (at least more than any other groups principles). It's just that it's too easy, when you see something wrong (real or perceived), to look to the government to "fix" the problem whether they can (or should) "fix" it in the first place. This leads to the whole "appearance of helping is more important than the results of the actions" phenomenon that many government programs seem to be a part of.
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face.bmpCarlos44ec - www.digi.com
06/13/2008 @ 03:26:08 PM
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i would like to think of myself as an informed person who is mature enough to make decisions for myself. There are many things that I do not need the government getting involved in, and frankly think that how I live my life is my business.

I don't bother my brother about getting married to the mother of his two kids, and I don't harass the people who like to smoke cigarettes. Those are their decisions, not mine.

There are too many far far (far far) right wingers in here for these types of conversations (you know, they types who won't let you have an opinion because it disagrees with theirs?)
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2887.gifAlex - Who controls the past now controls the future
06/13/2008 @ 09:42:35 PM
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For the record, I've moved on from 2 dimensional left-right politics and I'm going up in the 3rd dimension. The current 2 party system does not include Refactoring Mercilessly, and in fact it includes almost no refactoring. Just continual piling on of bad idea to fix previous bad ideas. One of the big themes to the race so far has been change. You want real change? Then don't look to Repulicans or Democrats because they're 2 sides of the same coin.
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jon.jpgJon - 1000000 posts (and counting!)
06/13/2008 @ 10:01:22 PM
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Carlos44ec Wrote - 06/13/2008 @ 03:26:08 PM
There are too many far far (far far) right wingers in here for these types of conversations (you know, they types who won't let you have an opinion because it disagrees with theirs?)


I'm confused.
Are you talking about on this website?
I'm not sure I'd describe anyone here in that way.
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - Pie Racist
06/13/2008 @ 11:39:37 PM
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It's not a practical idea, because we argue over enough new crap that never gets solved, but I think there should almost be an automatic revisiting of previous rulings/votes. There's a lot of garbage laws on the books from like the 1800's that should just be tossed, unless they still have merit. There's got to be a ton of spending programs that people don't even know about. It also doesn't help that we're making minimum payments on a 9 trillion dollar credit card bill. (I think 10 cents of every tax dollar goes to interest on the debt)

Also my original statement regarding Libertarian views being impractical in "principal" was because a lot of their views sort of center around the "tough shit" rule. I.e. no welfare or financial support for the poor ect. In a perfect world we wouldn't need those things. It should be pointed out that 1) they aren't heartless, their theory seems to be that welfare causes the welfare state. (The teach a man to fish situation) and 2) That's Libertarian views at their most extreme, and like democrats and republicans a person can fall along a spectrum.

It's also impractical as far as the fact that we already have many many people that rely on these programs, flawed though they may be, and we can't just pull the rug out from under them, and a Libertarian president would almost certainly never be allowed to do such a thing. Especially since even if you did you'd have a dramatic shift at the federal level with business-as-usual states.

I think the best place to start is a website that tracks as much of government spending as possible. Watchdog groups would almost certainly form, and wastes of money would be found and made public. We need to completely reevaluate where our money is going. We don't seem to be getting nearly as much for our tax dollars as citizens of other countries are getting for less.

Also, and I know on first glance it seems counter intuitive, but what if we doubled, or tripled, the term length for people in the House and/or Senate. It would cut down on the fact that the last 40% of the term is spent campaigning for the next term. It would solve needing to be on the "take" from corporations you later owe favors for, because you only need to pay for a campaign 1/2 or 1/3 of the time. The incumbency rate is so high it's basically what's happening anyway.
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Jeremy perfected this 2 times, last at 06/13/2008 11:44:38 pm
avatar2345.jpgPackOne - Well use me, use me, 'caus you ain't that average groupie.
06/14/2008 @ 10:28:35 AM
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Jeremy Wrote - 06/13/2008 @ 11:39:37 PM
It's not a practical idea, because we argue over enough new crap that never gets solved.


When did the topic change from politics to nutcan softball shirts?
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