Let's talk about suspending the federal gas tax!

05/06/2008 1:01 am
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We have a couple wanna-be economists on the site. What does everyone think about this?

I'll admit I'm a lay person, but it seems to me to be a terrible idea for the following reasons.

  • It wouldn't really save us that much each trip to the pump. (Roughly $2.50, or about 5ish%)
  • Though it wouldn't save us individually much I have to imagine it adds up to a crap load for the government, who would just need to get the money elsewhere.
  • Maybe it wouldn't react this quickly, but wouldn't cheaper gas just mean higher demand which would put the price right back where it was?
  • I don't mean to sound elitist, but if the extra $2 at the pump each time is determining whether or not you can take your family on vacation this summer, then going on vacation is probably the last thing you need to be doing.
thumbnailCAW1I0O3.gifMatt - 3354 Posts
05/06/2008 @ 05:28:03 AM
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"Maybe it wouldn't react this quickly, but wouldn't cheaper gas just mean higher demand which would put the price right back where it was?"

Not necessarily. Since the tax is "on" the sellers (they send the money to the gov't), you could look at the tax as affecting the supply curve instead of the demand curve.

After looking through an old textbook to refresh my econ knowledge, I think I can explain this. Hopefully it will make some sense.

tax.jpg
[Click to Enlarge]


P* and Q* = Equilibrium price and quantity in the market with no tax.

The tax will cause the supply curve (S) to move to the left by the amount of the tax, resulting in a new supply curve (St). This will raise the price consumers pay for a gallon from P* to Pc (as well as reducing the amount sold to Qt). Sellers then pay the tax from this price and thus only receive the price of Ps. Note that Pc - Ps = amount of the tax, and that the burden of the tax is split between the buyers and the sellers as buyers end up paying a higher price than they normally would (the difference between Pc and P*), while sellers end up receiving less than they normally would (the difference between P* and Ps).

So, a repeal of the tax would move things back to the original equilibrium and would mean that consumers would pay less to the sellers and sellers would pay less to the government, so everybody is happy (except the environmentalists).

You could also look at this as a change in demand instead of supply, which is how it is looked at when the tax is on the buyers (you send the government money each time you fill up). In that case, the demand curve would move left by the amount of the tax and the supply curve would stay the same (their intersection would be at the point (Qt, Ps)). However, this would change the price and quantity in the exact same way as before, only this time sellers would sell at Ps, and the tax would cause the real cost on the buyer to be Pc.

Now, some details will change depending on what the curves actually look like. In this case, I would guess that the demand curve for gas would be more inelastic (vertical), and this would cause the burden of the tax to fall more on buyers than sellers, but the overall story would be the same.

**Note** - My standard caveat applies here. This is just a simple model of what happens. There are probably many other factors in the real life that may completely change the whole picture. Also, there is the always the strong possibility that I have misinterpreted the economic concepts and am totally wrong in my explanations.
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Matt screwed with this 4 times, last at 05/06/2008 5:49:06 am
face.bmpCarlos44ec - 2078 Posts
05/06/2008 @ 07:41:48 AM
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I'm just going to say that with a suspended gas tax the government will just have less money to spend on other things. Knowing how our government works, they will spend more, not less, putting us farther in the stink.
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
05/06/2008 @ 08:59:35 AM
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Let's pretend that went a bit over our heads, Matt.

Is the gist of your post that the spirit of what I brought up is wrong (that one way or another the price will go down which will result in people buying more, which will lead to the price going up anyway) or that by using the word "demand" I was just technically incorrect, in terminology only?
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Jeremy edited this 2 times, last at 05/06/2008 9:46:47 am
scott.jpgScott - Resident Tech Support
05/06/2008 @ 10:41:51 AM
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In practice, this hasn't worked. Illinois tried it while Obama was a senator there, and the prices didn't go down hardly at all.
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jacobpeterdad.jpgbozz_2006 - 29 Posts
05/06/2008 @ 01:01:51 PM
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inflation. I don't know shit about economics or shit about S&D, but I know that the government takes money to run. The government taking less of our money means we have more (duh!), but the problem for Americans isn't an overall lack of dollars, but rather the decrease in value of the dollar. Funds can be shifted to make it seem like the economy is in better shape (See: Oakland Raiders salary Cap, for example), but smoke and mirrors only last so long. As long as this method stays intra-national, I can't see how this helps in the long run.
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2887.gifAlex - Ignorance is bliss to those uneducated
05/06/2008 @ 01:45:14 PM
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I think one of the bigger issues with gas prices is that they don't really seem to be driven by traditional supply and demand. The supply is "artificially" modified by our government stock piling oil or some foreign country decide to try and screw people over and the demand seems to be in large based on the investors demand for buying oil futures instead of the actual demand at the pump. The whole thing is giant mess really that has only gotten worse with globalization, speed of light communications, and personal investing going up.

If you have a family of 5 and drive a full size SUV pulling a boat on a 600 mile round trip vacation, 5%ish could be sizable. That said, I think it's a bad idea at least until the US deficit is gone, there's a balanced budget, and government spending has been curtailed/smartened/not sucked.
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jacobpeterdad.jpgbozz_2006
05/06/2008 @ 01:49:31 PM
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Alex Wrote - 05/06/2008 @ 01:45:14 PM
I think it's a bad idea at least until the US deficit is gone, there's a balanced budget, and government spending has been curtailed/smartened/not sucked.


So... never
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
05/06/2008 @ 01:57:54 PM
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Well, to me it seems we'd have the same amount of many anyway. Taxes are just a big shell game, the government is going to get theirs whether or not you feel better at the pump.

I don't mean to come across anti tax, roads and schools cost money and there's just certain things the private sector can't be expected to do.

Though Matt hinted at it we haven't really discussed that in the long run we might be better off with gas being expensive right now. Necessity is the mother of all invention, and no one cares we're sending our money oversees to shady governments and are dependent on a power source that will eventually dry up. People DO care about switching when gas is $4 a gallon.
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matt.jpgMatt - Ombudsman
05/06/2008 @ 02:55:11 PM
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More importantly, businesses believe that people care about switching when prices are that high, therefore they are willing to take the risk on new technologies since they see potential profits.
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Matt screwed with this at 01/28/2011 11:08:01 pm
matt.jpgMatt - Nutcan.com's MBL
05/06/2008 @ 03:12:37 PM
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Jeremy Wrote - 05/06/2008 @ 08:59:35 AM
Let's pretend that went a bit over our heads, Matt. Is the gist of your post that the spirit of what I brought up is wrong (that one way or another the price will go down which will result in people buying more, which will lead to the price going up anyway) or that by using the word "demand" I was just technically incorrect, in terminology only?


A little of both, I guess. The main point I was getting at was that in a normal case (of which I have no idea if the gas market is one), the tax screws up the "natural" equalibrium and when it is removed, things go back to the equilibrium where the S&D lines meet. In the case above, the price at the pump would decrease from Pc to P* and that would be that until some other factor came along to change either of the two curves.

The terminology thing is something I think we've discussed before. Basically to economists there is a difference between "demand" and "quantity demanded". Demand refers to the placement/shape of the curve itself, while quantity demanded refers to where you are on that curve. In the example above, as the supply curve changes, demand doesn't change, but qty. demanded does. So, changes in price don't affect "demand", they affect qty. demanded. To change "demand", you would need something like a report saying that putting gasoline on your lawn makes it grow better. Then, people would be willing to buy more gasoline at any given price, which would shift the curve to the right.
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vignette.bmpCarlos44ec - Tater Salad?
05/06/2008 @ 04:12:54 PM
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The way I look at it is this:

Everytime I go to the Pump, I feel like someone took a shovel to the side of my face. This makes me (because I is smert) want to go there as little as I can. If the shovel-bearer uses a smaller shovel, it might still hurt, but it hurts less. I r still smertish, so I figure out if the decrease in pain can be tolerated for another trip.

Hurts either way.
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - Robots don't say 'ye'
05/06/2008 @ 04:42:01 PM
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I actually get excited at the pump as the total price goes up and the tank nears $60, like it's a reverse slot machine or something. It's like I feel it's bizarro world bragging rights, or at least a would-be conversation starter I'd never use, if I were to trip that milestone. It's odd.

Edit: Also I remember playing this game in the not too distant past with $40 and $50. Oh, how times have changed.
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Jeremy screwed with this 5 times, last at 05/06/2008 4:51:47 pm
vignette.bmpCarlos44ec - 2078 Posts
05/06/2008 @ 07:24:53 PM
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Not all of us make tons of money on the inter-web thing. I've never felt that way.
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jon.jpgJon - 2847 Posts
05/07/2008 @ 04:04:24 AM
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Matt Wrote - 05/06/2008 @ 03:12:37 PM
To change "demand", you would need something like a report saying that putting gasoline on your lawn makes it grow better.




"Gerald Ford, dead today, and lawns love gasoline."
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Jon messed with this at 05/07/2008 4:08:47 am
wendy.gifWendy - 163 Posts
05/07/2008 @ 11:19:01 AM
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I'll get that on the 5:00pm news tonight
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hoochpage.JPGSarah - 4091 Posts
05/07/2008 @ 05:48:42 PM
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So the gas station at Menomonie and Clairemont has their gas 10 cents cheaper than everywhere else in Eau Claire. People are backed up into the streets to fill their tanks at this gas station to save approximately $1.00 to $2.00. That's ridiculous. I think people lose their minds a little when it comes to gasoline.
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sarah.jpgSarah - 4091 Posts
05/07/2008 @ 08:28:21 PM
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Update: We went out to eat for the ol' anniversary and we drove past that gas station to get to the restaurant, where there were still a ton of cars to get gas for $3.63. When we drove back home, they had changed the price to $3.72 (still a penny cheaper than anywhere else!) but the place was completely empty. So bizarre.
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Sarah messed with this at 05/07/2008 10:24:33 pm
avatar2345.jpgPackOne - You analyze me. Tend to despise me. You laugh when I stumble and fall.
05/07/2008 @ 08:31:46 PM
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Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/06/2008 @ 07:24:53 PM
Not all of us make tons of money on the inter-web thing. I've never felt that way.


I agree, for some of us two bucks can literally mean dinner somedays.
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jacobpeterdad.jpgbozz_2006 - 29 Posts
05/07/2008 @ 10:16:22 PM
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was it really 2.63, or was it 3.63?
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sarah.jpgSarah - 4091 Posts
05/07/2008 @ 10:23:42 PM
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oops! Those were the good old days way back when I can't even remember!
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Sarah screwed with this at 05/07/2008 10:24:03 pm
flower .jpgPackOne - 1528 Posts
05/07/2008 @ 10:26:20 PM
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I don't know anywhere in town where gas is 2.72.
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - Cube Phenomenoligist
05/07/2008 @ 10:35:50 PM
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When I worked at Copps back in the day they didn't change the price of gas one morning and decided to leave the gas 5 cents cheaper then other places. The station was out of gas by noon. I shudder to think how much gas is wasted in the pursuit of microscopically cheaper gas.

PackOne Wrote - 05/07/2008 @ 08:31:46 PM
Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/06/2008 @ 07:24:53 PM
Not all of us make tons of money on the inter-web thing. I've never felt that way.


I agree, for some of us two bucks can literally mean dinner some days.


If there's any truth to that please stop donating money to us. emoticon As much as we appreciate it I think I can speak for all the "creators" when I say, "I think you should worry about eating first"
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thumbnailCAW1I0O3.gifMatt - Ombudsman
05/08/2008 @ 03:01:20 AM
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Sarah Wrote - 05/07/2008 @ 05:48:42 PM
That's ridiculous. I think people lose their minds a little when it comes to gasoline.


Agreed

Sarah Wrote - 05/07/2008 @ 05:48:42 PM
So the gas station at Menomonie and Clairemont has their gas 10 cents cheaper than everywhere else in Eau Claire. People are backed up into the streets to fill their tanks at this gas station to save approximately $1.00 to $2.00.


Jeremy Wrote - 05/07/2008 @ 10:35:50 PM
When I worked at Copps back in the day they didn't change the price of gas one morning and decided to leave the gas 5 cents cheaper then other places. The station was out of gas by noon.


This is why its stupid when people start complaining about "price gouging" all the time. People are so crazy about gas prices that they will go out of their way to save a few cents/gallon. Because stations can get a huge bump in customers with slightly lower prices, there are huge incentives to "undercut" each other until gas prices across the board are as low as you can get.

The fact that the Copps station ran out by noon that day shows why it's not always a bad thing when gas prices rise quickly when there is a sudden increase in demand (like after a national disaster, or any other time that people expect there to be an interruption in supply). Most of the times in these situations, the panic or supply interruption only lasts a few days or so and people overreact and "hoard" gas even though they may not really need to. This means that the next day no station will have gas for the customer who really needs it. The price increase helps to fight this by making it more likely that the gas station will keep enough of a supply to last until the next shipment, thus allowing the gas to remain for those who probably need it the most (and thus are willing to pay the higher price).
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Matt messed with this at 05/08/2008 3:02:57 pm
vignette.bmpCarlos44ec - 2078 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 07:50:28 AM
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I was still working at Mega Mart on Craig Rd on Sept 11. I had the 6-9 shift that night and all hell had broken loose. We had people backed up to the soccer fields over there, and when we closed down (we were approaching the low tank level where sediment can be a problem) we had people getting punched in the lines trying to rush forward and get their lawn mower cans filled.

Gas is 3.63 here today, what is it in the Eau C? (I effing hate that)
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sarah.jpgSarah - 4091 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 08:09:01 AM
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Maybe we should all rush over to MN because last night it was $3.73 or $3.72 if you went to that one gas station, maybe it'll go up again today.
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vignette.bmpCarlos44ec - 2078 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 08:20:30 AM
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The closest MN gas station is the Oasis in Bayport. Thats about 70 miles from EC. It makes TOTAL ECONOMIC SENSE to drive the 140 miles round trip, if you factor out grabbing a bite to eat.
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 08:37:19 AM
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Matt Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 03:01:20 AM
will go out of there way to save a few cents/gallon

emoticon
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jacobpeterdad.jpgbozz_2006
05/08/2008 @ 10:28:10 AM
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Minnesota has some kind of law against price gouging. Not real sure how it works, but the state sets the minimum price. if you sell it for less, you get fined big time.
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 10:44:36 AM
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Price gouging would be like if after 9/11 you were the only station in town with gas and you charged like $15 a gallon (though that would be an extreme example, it has to do with charging too much, not to little). I suspect they set a minimum price because in many areas having a loss leader is illegal. For example a grocery store isn't allowed to put their pop on sale for less than they paid for it. The store's reason would be to take a hit on the one item to get you in the store, assuming a certain percentage will buy other things. The reason it's illegal, as far as I know, is for competition reasons. The Walmarts of the world could risk this more often than the locally owned grocery store. Personally I don't have a problem with it, I think it's a pretty antiquated rule. Walmart can already undercut pretty much everyone on pretty much everything. Mom and pop places already can't compete. The only people being hurt by not allowing Walmart to have the EXTREME discount once in a while is us consumers.

It would probably be especially prevalent for gas stations to do this since they make so little on the gas anyway, they make their money by getting you into the store. So the bigger places with the bigger stores could put the "mom and pop" place, which might have a tiny, or no, convenience store, out of business pretty quickly if they were allowed to lose a few cents a gallon rather than make a few cents a gallon in an effort to get people into the store.

I think this is why lots of places are starting to have a card that saves you 2-3 cents a gallon, but you have to go into the store to use it. They are forgoing their few cent profit to get you into the store where you might pick up a $4+ gallon of milk.
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Jeremy perfected this 4 times, last at 05/08/2008 10:50:58 am
wendy.gifWendy - 163 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 11:19:28 AM
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In October, a judge ruled the minimum markup law (which was 70 years old) unconstitutional. In theory it was supposed to bring prices down, but so far, I don't see that, mostly because lawmakers haven't done anything to actually get rid of the law or stop enforcing it (it was in place partly-mostly to keep small mom & pops in business and not be run out by big chains)
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 11:47:31 AM
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Well, we pretty much only have big chains left anyway, so I'm glad they got rid of it.
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jacobpeterdad.jpgbozz_2006
05/08/2008 @ 11:58:58 AM
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Jeremy Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 10:44:36 AM
Price gouging would be like if after 9/11 you were the only station in town with gas and you charged like $15 a gallon (though that would be an extreme example, it has to do with charging too much, not to little). I suspect they set a minimum price because in many areas having a loss leader is illegal. For example a grocery store isn't allowed to put their pop on sale for less than they paid for it. The store's reason would be to take a hit on the one item to get you in the store, assuming a certain percentage will buy other things. The reason it's illegal, as far as I know, is for competition reasons. The Walmarts of the world could risk this more often than the locally owned grocery store. Personally I don't have a problem with it, I think it's a pretty antiquated rule. Walmart can already undercut pretty much everyone on pretty much everything. Mom and pop places already can't compete. The only people being hurt by not allowing Walmart to have the EXTREME discount once in a while is us consumers.

It would probably be especially prevalent for gas stations to do this since they make so little on the gas anyway, they make their money by getting you into the store. So the bigger places with the bigger stores could put the "mom and pop" place, which might have a tiny, or no, convenience store, out of business pretty quickly if they were allowed to lose a few cents a gallon rather than make a few cents a gallon in an effort to get people into the store.

I think this is why lots of places are starting to have a card that saves you 2-3 cents a gallon, but you have to go into the store to use it. They are forgoing their few cent profit to get you into the store where you might pick up a $4+ gallon of milk.


yep
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face.bmpCarlos44ec - "If at first you don't succeed, failure may be your style."
05/08/2008 @ 12:24:07 PM
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bozz_2006 Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 10:28:10 AM
Minnesota has some kind of law against price gouging. Not real sure how it works, but the state sets the minimum price. if you sell it for less, you get fined big time.


Yet the state can drop the ball on infrastructure maintenance and rape us for a few more cents per gallon... and THEN give reparations to its victims on our dime.
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Carlos44ec messed with this at 05/08/2008 12:25:12 pm
wendy.gifWendy
05/08/2008 @ 12:29:59 PM
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Not a fan of that $38 million dollar compensation package?
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - Robots don't say 'ye'
05/08/2008 @ 12:40:55 PM
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It's just systemic of our overall approach in our culture. Nothing is important 'til after something bad happens. What? Repairing and upgrading those levees would be expensive! Putting locks and stronger doors on cockpits would be expensive! Sometimes it ends up being a drop in the bucket compared to the resulting cost.

Though to be fair I haven't read up much on the bridge. Was it really an imminent disaster they ignored or band-aided, or was it just an accident?
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2887.gifAlex - 3618 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 01:19:12 PM
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Matt Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 03:01:20 AM
The fact that the Copps station ran out by noon that day shows why it's not always a bad thing when gas prices rise quickly when there is a sudden increase in demand (like after a national disaster, or any other time that people expect there to be an interruption in supply). Most of the times in these situations, the panic or supply interruption only lasts a few days or so and people overreact and "hoard" gas even though they may not really need to. This means that the next day no station will have gas for the customer who really needs it. The price increase helps to fight this by making it more likely that the gas station will keep enough of a supply to last until the next shipment, thus allowing the gas to remain for those who probably need it the most (and thus are willing to pay the higher price).


Except most of the people hoarding gas aren't really thinking rationally, so they aren't going to care whether the price is $3 or $20, they're going to buy it anyway.
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - Super Chocolate Bear
05/08/2008 @ 01:23:14 PM
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I think we're all missing the most obvious solution to all our gas problems: Banding together to not by gas on a certain day. My uncle's friend's neighbor is a high school economics teacher and he says that the big oil companies would be so effected by the one day that gas would be 40 cents a gallon the next day!

Join me everyone! How goes next Wednesday sound?
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wendy.gifWendy - 163 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 01:42:04 PM
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Jeremy Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 12:40:55 PM
It's just systemic of our overall approach in our culture. Nothing is important 'til after something bad happens. What? Repairing and upgrading those levees would be expensive! Putting locks and stronger doors on cockpits would be expensive! Sometimes it ends up being a drop in the bucket compared to the resulting cost. Though to be fair I haven't read up much on the bridge. Was it really an imminent disaster they ignored or band-aided, or was it just an accident?


I think the most recent update from the investigation said something about connecting plates that couldn't hold the weight and were corroded. They also found photos from a few summers back (2003? 2004?) that showed those plates bending.
I think. Ask the Minnesota resident.
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wendy.gifWendy - 163 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 01:43:07 PM
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Jeremy Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 01:23:14 PM
I think we're all missing the most obvious solution to all our gas problems: Banding together to not by gas on a certain day. My uncle's friend's neighbor is a high school economics teacher and he says that the big oil companies would be so effected by the one day that gas would be 40 cents a gallon the next day! Join me everyone! How goes next Wednesday sound?


You also have a distant relative in Uzbekestan who passed away and left much of his estate to you, you can collect it if you'll just cut a check for 5,600 rubles
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fry6beeu9.jpgJeremy - I believe virtually everything I read.
05/08/2008 @ 01:46:10 PM
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Wendy Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 01:43:07 PM
Jeremy Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 01:23:14 PM
I think we're all missing the most obvious solution to all our gas problems: Banding together to not by gas on a certain day. My uncle's friend's neighbor is a high school economics teacher and he says that the big oil companies would be so effected by the one day that gas would be 40 cents a gallon the next day! Join me everyone! How goes next Wednesday sound?


You also have a distant relative in Uzbekestan who passed away and left much of his estate to you, you can collect it if you'll just cut a check for 5,600 rubles


Well that was just the fee to get my riches out of hock. I'm supposed to go meet the guy in Europe to collect the money, but he needs money for his travel expenses and I'm going to send him something extra because his grandfather is very ill.
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vignette.bmpCarlos44ec - www.digi.com
05/08/2008 @ 02:42:14 PM
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Wendy Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 12:29:59 PM
Not a fan of that $38 million dollar compensation package?


I don't have a problem with people being given what is due, but I have a major problem with people winning the lotto after an accident (this case) or an inconvenience (pain and suffering).
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Carlos44ec messed with this at 05/08/2008 2:42:33 pm
matt.jpgMatt - 3354 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 03:00:28 PM
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Jeremy Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 08:37:19 AM
Matt Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 03:01:20 AM
will go out of there way to save a few cents/gallon
emoticon


Really Mr. Ron L., really?
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - No one's gay for Moleman
05/08/2008 @ 03:03:15 PM
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Yes, almost the same thing.
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jon.jpgJon - 2847 Posts
05/08/2008 @ 10:35:25 PM
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I don't know why you chose now to make an issue of other people's grammar, but I was behind on this thread and so I read a bunch of posts just now and the fact that I noticed the following quote
Jeremy Wrote - 05/07/2008 @ 10:35:50 PM
and decided to leave the gas 5 cents cheaper then other places.


then saw you making an issue of a different homonym mistake a few posts later made it all the more classic.

laughing dog omitted for everyone's sake.
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avatar2345.jpgPackOne - Yeah, and you don't stop, 'caus its 1-8-7 on a ...
05/08/2008 @ 11:26:54 PM
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Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 12:24:07 PM
bozz_2006 Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 10:28:10 AM
Minnesota has some kind of law against price gouging. Not real sure how it works, but the state sets the minimum price. if you sell it for less, you get fined big time.
Yet the state can drop the ball on infrastructure maintenance and **** us for a few more cents per gallon... and THEN give reparations to its victims on our dime.


Again, please.
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - 8953 Posts
05/09/2008 @ 12:10:07 AM
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Jon Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 10:35:25 PM
I don't know why you chose now to make an issue of other people's grammar, but I was behind on this thread and so I read a bunch of posts just now and the fact that I noticed the following quote
Jeremy Wrote - 05/07/2008 @ 10:35:50 PM
and decided to leave the gas 5 cents cheaper then other places.


then saw you making an issue of a different homonym mistake a few posts later made it all the more classic.

laughing dog omitted for everyone's sake.


Because we were just talking about the there/their/they're thing.

Lighten up people.
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jon.jpgJon - 2847 Posts
05/09/2008 @ 01:03:43 AM
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Yeah people, lighten up!
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face.bmpCarlos44ec - 2078 Posts
05/09/2008 @ 07:40:48 AM
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PackOne Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 11:26:54 PM
Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 12:24:07 PM
bozz_2006 Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 10:28:10 AM
Minnesota has some kind of law against price gouging. Not real sure how it works, but the state sets the minimum price. if you sell it for less, you get fined big time.
Yet the state can drop the ball on infrastructure maintenance and **** us for a few more cents per gallon... and THEN give reparations to its victims on our dime.
Again, please.


The 35W bridge collapse. They're giving all kinds of money to the people who were injured- even after their hospital bills are covered (with tax money). Then they want to raise our state gas tax by 25c over 5 years to pay for the repairs to the bridge. This is in addition to all the other taxes we've been paying.
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face.bmpCarlos44ec - 2078 Posts
05/09/2008 @ 07:41:09 AM
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Jon Wrote - 05/09/2008 @ 01:03:43 AM
Yeah people, lighten up!


emoticon
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Carlos44ec screwed with this at 05/09/2008 7:41:28 am
flower .jpgPackOne - At the Dollhouse in Ft. Lauderdale.
05/09/2008 @ 08:35:43 AM
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Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/09/2008 @ 07:40:48 AM
PackOne Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 11:26:54 PM
Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 12:24:07 PM
bozz_2006 Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 10:28:10 AM
Minnesota has some kind of law against price gouging. Not real sure how it works, but the state sets the minimum price. if you sell it for less, you get fined big time.
Yet the state can drop the ball on infrastructure maintenance and **** us for a few more cents per gallon... and THEN give reparations to its victims on our dime.
Again, please.
The 35W bridge collapse. They're giving all kinds of money to the people who were injured- even after their hospital bills are covered (with tax money). Then they want to raise our state gas tax by 25c over 5 years to pay for the repairs to the bridge. This is in addition to all the other taxes we've been paying.


I didn't need a summary, I was asking that you refrain from using certain verbs inappropriately.
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jeremy.jpgJeremy - Always thinking of, but never about, the children.
05/09/2008 @ 09:02:02 AM
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Jon Wrote - 05/09/2008 @ 01:03:43 AM
Yeah people, lighten up!


I don't get it.
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face.bmpCarlos44ec - 2078 Posts
05/09/2008 @ 10:09:27 AM
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PackOne Wrote - 05/09/2008 @ 08:35:43 AM
Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/09/2008 @ 07:40:48 AM
PackOne Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 11:26:54 PM
Carlos44ec Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 12:24:07 PM
bozz_2006 Wrote - 05/08/2008 @ 10:28:10 AM
Minnesota has some kind of law against price gouging. Not real sure how it works, but the state sets the minimum price. if you sell it for less, you get fined big time.
Yet the state can drop the ball on infrastructure maintenance and **** us for a few more cents per gallon... and THEN give reparations to its victims on our dime.
Again, please.
The 35W bridge collapse. They're giving all kinds of money to the people who were injured- even after their hospital bills are covered (with tax money). Then they want to raise our state gas tax by 25c over 5 years to pay for the repairs to the bridge. This is in addition to all the other taxes we've been paying.
I didn't need a summary, I was asking that you refrain from using certain verbs inappropriately.


"...[to forcefully take something from us against our will]..."
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